but it keeps eating away at me....PROP 8!!!!!!!
Did the church ever officially instruct members to oppose the civil rights movement on the grounds that blacks could not hold the priesthood? President Monson has taken a matter of doctrine, limitations of gay's in church activity, and asked us to extend that to public policy. As far as I can tell, despite the fact that blacks were officially unequal in the priesthood, the prophet never asked us to enforce that same inequality in society. This is why am have been so shaken by this whole thing. For the prophet to go so far as to essentially command all saints to oppose same-sex marriage either means it is really important or he is a complete fraud.
I don't see how I can just sweep it under the rug and casually say that they must be mistaken on this one. I can say that when my sunday school teacher refutes global warming or evolution, or even when general authorities do. Of course they have never told me to vote against global warming initiatives or fund creationist education advocates.
I guess my confession is that I'm closer to the edge than I want to be.
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
9 comments:
Give Max a call and have him tell you about the INSANITY going on in our ward/stake.
"either means it is really important or he is a complete fraud"
Yeah, it is really important and I don't think it should be swept under the rug.
One thing I have had a hard time with is how some members are like "i'm so embarrassed now to be a member of the church because of this issue", and "I don't think the church should have any say in this matter."
When I think about the people who say that, I think, well, it is optional to be a member of the church. If you don't believe in the churches teachings, i.e. that having homosexual relationships is a sin and marriage is only between a man and a woman, then it would be hard to have a testimony that God speaks to the Prophet and that this is God's church on the earth, and if a person does not have a testimony of those things, then I don't see why they would still want to be a member of the church. We can't pick and choose the teachings we believe in.
I think a lot of people have left the church over this matter and I'm sure a lot more will leave in the future. I am saddened by this but know that everyone has their free will.
Its a complicated issue that I don't understand fully, and if I wasn't a member I would be all for gay marriage, but I am glad I have a testimony that the church is true so that when issues like this come up, I do not have a hard time following the prophets teachings.
" I guess my confession is that I'm closer to the edge than I want to be."
i think this is one of the most beautiful confessions of this blog. go looking for answers and you will get them. i think the best thing we can do in the church is ask questions and get answers.
Marcilyn, (if you happen back to the comments here) I'm going to say this as gently as I can. I could be wrong, but I don't feel from your comment like you are saddened by the fact that people might leave the church over this. Have you thought about what that might be like for you personally? You can't feel empathy for someone if you don't see a little bit of their struggle in your own life. Based on the black and white tone of your comment, it seems like you are not willing to reach across that divide and consider a particular issue that would make it hard for you to accept a teaching of the president of the church.
Your statement that you're glad you have a testimony so you don't have a hard time following the prophet I'm sure is heartfelt, but it implies that following the President of the church is easy if one simply has a testimony. I will refute that from personal experience. I can also testify that Chad has a testimony of the church. This hasn't been easy for either of us. To my mind, a testimony of the church is a process, and never does it allow a person to skip the soul-searching prayers of repentance, which is to say training one's soul to be more in line with God's.
If you are saddened by the prospect of people like Chad and myself leaving the church, people with testimonies and plenty of ability to offer in building up the church, there is more that you can do to help, but it doesn't involve reiterating how a testimony will help one follow the President of the church.
ps Chad don't kick yourself out of the church. They can't make you stop going.
I'm not even close to kicking myself out of the church. I guess what I mean by being close to the edge is that I see myself as having more in common with people over the edge than people "safely in the fold" (if there is such a thing). I suppose that's the way it always was there was just no real challenge to bring it to a head. I've also never felt disliked in church before. That is hard.
I'm also, at the same time, questioning my support for gay marriage. Are we seeking civil equality or minority cultural hegemony? The aftermath of prop 8 (particularly the religious discrimination) has me thinking the latter. The kind of backlash against Mormon individuals (not only the institution) is unprecedented in any so called "oppressed" group's struggle for equality in America. This isn't Cuba, you're not Che, and your not fighting for food. But I digress, because I also don't believe that offensive and rude behavior is grounds for legal inequity.
I do, in a way, envy reductionists.
Testimony + Living Prophet = Unexamined acceptance of every stamped memo
or
Happily denying the contradictions in Church doctrine > Being disturbed by such
I, unfortunately, look at the church and cannot see an infallible institution. I see the Mountain Meadows Massacre and know that the prophet will be allowed to command saints to do terrible things without major intervention from the Lord. I just don't like it.
Finally, I guess I most resent the Church's failure to address the concerns of so many saints in relation to this issue. We want explanation, direction, or at least some assurance. We've gotten hackneyed bargaining and fear mongering. But don't be alarmed, I've still got the Book of Mormon which is so true.
Nathan, sorry if I came off a bit black and white in my comment. I agree with everything you wrote. I guess my previous comment wasn't directed at people like you and chad who are members of the church who, despite struggling with one of the teachings of the prophet, remain strong and faithful. I was thinking of those people who want it both ways. They want to speak out against the church and affiliate with organizations that speak out against the church, and yet still want to hold a recommend. They want to say the church is way off on this one and join anti-prop 8 rallies and yet still believe they are keeping the commandments.
I don't believe that we need to have blind faith. We can question and struggle with a commandment but with issues like this we need to have faith. The definition of faith itself implies not having a perfect knowledge and to have faith we have to consciously choose to work toward it. We don't know how the issue of homosexuality will be worked out now or in the eternities but we can have faith that God knows what he is doing.
Of course I don't encourage anyone who questions a teaching of the church to leave the church or to question their overall faith in God, the Prophets or the Church. I've questioned commandments before. I'm not perfect. But the scriptures tell us to keep the commandments to the best of our ability. If we do lack faith in one area and don't, for instance, support the brethren when they tell us to speak out against gay marriage,or to do our civic duty and vote, just to name a few, it will be necessary for us to repent one day. There is no way around that. This is true with every commandment we break. But the atonement accounts for those times we don't have the faith.
I am willing to help those who struggle, just as I know others have helped me when I've had trouble following teachings of the church. If someone wants help it implies that they are trying to keep the commandments of the Lord and working toward having faith. It is those who don't want help that we will have to pray for.
I would like to bear my testimony here but it just comes off sounding holier than thou, no matter how i put it.
ps. And I questioned commenting on this post because this blog is kind of like a safe zone where everyone can opening talk about the crazy things in their lives, but I feel like this has been a good discussion, enlightening for me at least. This is a good confession.
I've said so much already, but Chad, I too am upset that the church hasn't given us any direction or reassurance as of late about Prop 8 and the subsequent persecution. Glad someone else finds that disheartening.
Post a Comment